Path to Grace

This week, the Cheer Up Podcast discusses Cheri Swalwell's,  book, "Path to Grace." As we unravel the threads of character evolution and spirituality in her Redemption of Green Pine series, you're invited to witness the strength of siblings Holly, Wyn, and Ariana as they confront the scars of their past and embrace the promise of redemption. 

Wyn's tale of overcoming her father's emotional abuse and the family's battle with the consequences of pornography tugs at the heartstrings, illuminating the impact of such struggles on relationships and self-perception. We discuss the delicate balance of portraying these sensitive themes with the grace they deserve. We reflect on the hesitations that come with delving into tough subjects and the faith-led decision to shine a light on the darker aspects of human experience, all in the hope of fostering understanding and healing. 

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:19

Hi and welcome to the Cheer Up Podcast. I am your host, kara R Hunt, and with me is the lovely Sherry Swalwell. How are you doing today, sherry?

Speaker 2: 0:30

I am doing great. I am loving this month. What about you?

Speaker 1: 0:37

The start of the year is always a good thing to me. I have a thing for new beginnings, right. It kind of reminds me of how we're lost and seeing and then, when you're born again, it's like a whole new life, a whole new beginning, completely different than the one you had before. January. The beginning of the year reminds me of that. Of course, we all know Genesis in the beginning. The first book in the Bible is a book of beginning.

Speaker 1: 1:09

I am excited about this year and I'm excited about the topics we're talking about this month, which is our work. We're talking about the podcast later next week, I think Next week's episode. We're talking about the past couple of years of us doing a podcast. This week we were talking last week, first week of January we talked about the release of my new book, book four, which is Paper Dolls Lydia, which is a continuation of the Paper Doll series. She just came out in the fall and so we talked about her.

Speaker 1: 1:45

This week we're talking about one of your books, book five, path to Grace. For those of you who have not yet had the chance to read it, I highly recommend you do it. I am giving it five plus plus, plus stars. It is definitely a book you want to read, and I promise you, not only is it one of those books that you can so resonate with, but it's also one of those books that you're going to be a better person because you read it. Not only that, you're going to be thoroughly entertained, and you're just absolutely going to love this particular book in this series and definitely look forward to the next one. So, sherry, path to Grace Wow, this is the fifth book in your series, am I right? Yes, yes, and it is. So I am just going to ask a few just one or two or three questions about the book, and I first tell us a little bit what the book is about, and then I'm going to ask my first question.

Speaker 2: 3:00

Well, the funny thing is is that the Redemption of Green Pine series was supposed to really just be a one book standalone. It was supposed to be Journey Back Home, and it was supposed to be about Jace and Simone and a little bit about Holly. But when I finished writing Journey Back Home, I realized that Holly had her own story that needed to be told, and I had to sit there and just think about her a little bit and be like, okay, what of her story needs to be told? And so I remember I was driving our kids to the dentist and it took us a little while to get there, which just now reminds me I need to call and reschedule or schedule a dentist appointment.

Speaker 2: 3:44

I don't know if I should put that on the list, but I digress. But so as I was driving to the dentist, god just kind of downloaded to me who Holly was. Well, in the second book, which was the first book I wrote, journey Back Home, you're introduced to this foursome. They're kind of like the four musketeers Wyn, addie, zayn and Owen, and Addie and Owen kind of like each other, and Zayn really likes Wyn, and Wyn has decided she wasn't going to be known to everybody, that she is never going to get married. She will never marry in her entire life, and that is just fine with her. And so after I figured out who Holly was and what Holly's story was, I had to figure out what Wyn's story was. And, to be honest with you, when I first started thinking about the book, her story was completely different than the one that God revealed and the one that God told me he wanted me to write. And so when I was writing Wyn's story, I was like, really, god, this is the story you want me to write Really. And he was like, yes, and so she is book four, road to Freedom.

Speaker 2: 5:01

And when I finished writing Wyn's story, I realized she has a younger sister, a sister who is the princess of the family, and I realized that God was having me ask the question how is it that two girls raised in the same household by the same parents could live such different lives and have such different experiences? What would that look like? Wyn was the servant girl. Basically she was the Cinderella in the book. She was the one that was the scapegoat. She was the one that was blamed for everything. She was the forgotten, just not treated well at all by her father.

Speaker 2: 5:46

And Ariana, who is the main character of book five of Pastor Grace, was the princess. She could do no wrong until she did. She made one mistake, and when she made that mistake, she fell from the pedestal. And the book is about learning how to give yourself grace, learning how to give other people grace, learning what grace really means. So basically, in a nutshell, that is how Pastor Grace came about, because it was answering the question what would it look like?

Speaker 2: 6:26

So Ariana's life looked like it was all there and all together, and then, when you started uncovering the layers, you saw how very similar they really were and how much she needed to be given grace and how much she needed redemption, and she needed understanding and forgiveness just as much as the wind did. So that's just kind of the premise of the story in a nutshell, and that was all God. Because one, I didn't want to write about the topic that is covered in wind story and I didn't really want to go down the avenue of Ariana either, because when I wrote wind story in book four I didn't like Ariana, I didn't like her at all, which actually made her really fun to write in the beginning, before her change, before she was redeemed. She was really fun to write in the beginning of book five.

Speaker 1: 7:31

She was a bad girl, yeah.

Speaker 2: 7:33

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 7:34

Yeah, kind of kind of but and that kind of centers around my first question, no-transcript. So Wynn and Ariana are sisters, and books four and five, rolls of Freedom and Path to Grace, actually go together very, very, very well Now, obviously by them being sisters. They grew up in the same household, as you mentioned, and two of the characters that are prominent in each book are their parents and how, the decisions that their parents made in the way how they treated and or approached the girls individually and their sisters, and the effects they had on them, on their life. Not and yeah, and that explains why you know Wynn's Rolls of Freedom and then Ariana's path to grace. So my question is regarding the parents, how did you feel writing about them and what made you, what made you want to make them such a huge part of the story? And we're actually a two part question, because the decisions they made ended up affecting their daughter significantly in different ways, but significantly. So let's talk a little bit about the parents and and Ariana's parents and Wynn's parents.

Speaker 2: 9:08

So the whole way that Wynn's story came about and the way that God changed the path that I had Wynn taking from book two to book four was he gave me a dream and the dream was one scene in Rolls of Freedom's book. It was the scene of Ariana's graduation party, graduation from high school, and and what transpired after the graduation. And it was funny because when God gave me that scene I had absolutely no idea that it would become an entire book. I had absolutely no idea what God wanted to do with it and I don't think I mean it's kind of a spoiler alert, but but kind of not. Hopefully by this time you've read um Rolls of Freedom, and if you haven't, that's okay, I'll give you just a little bit, and then I don't. Hopefully it will just peak your interest. It won't necessarily ruin the storyline for you. But the secret that Wynn holds is that her dad is enmeshed in pornography. He, um, he treats his wife terribly. He's emotionally abusive to Tessa. So Leonard is her dad and he treats Tessa terribly. He criticizes her, he cuts her down. He, he's horrible, absolutely horrible. And that is one of the reasons why um Wynn is emphatic that she's not going to get married because she thinks all men are like that, um, which is really interesting, because she had been around Zane for years and Zane was never like that. But she just figured, once they get married, once, once a man hooked the woman, then it's all downhill from there and she just was not going to be a part of that. She had suffered her whole life and she, this, was not going to be a part of that. And so, um, so, lester, he, he doesn't like Wynn because she doesn't fit the standard of beauty that he thinks he deserves. His wife doesn't fit that standard anymore either, and he left her know it week after week, day after day. Um, he's horrid. And Arianna, you soon find out that even though she fits the standard of her dad, she hasn't wrapped around her finger. Um, there's a price that she pays too in order to keep up her standard of living, in order to stay on that pedestal, and it's exhausting. And so you get a glimmer of that. Um, it's a very beginning of the book. Well, something happened and she falls from grace, she falls off the pedestal and she never, never thought that her dad would turn on her because she thought, like I said, that she had it wrapped up in a bag and that her dad was, um, you know she would always be her daddy's little princess. Well, she soon realized that daddy has no favorites and he just lives for himself. And when she was no longer um, following his rules and living up to his expectations, she was just as easily thrown in the trash as everybody else. And um, so the mom takes the fallout. Arianna takes the fallout. When does it really care? She just comes alongside her sister because she's like, been there, done that. I was never his favorite, ever, and um, so she's able to extend grace to her sister and kind of help her through it. I think they're doing pretty well.

Speaker 2: 12:52

Their oldest brother. So the birth order is Randy, wynn and Ariana. And Randy, he was following in his dad's footsteps until Wynn had chosen the road to freedom, learned what real Christ follower, what it really truly means to have an identity in Christ. Until she introduces him to the real God, he becomes a Christ follower himself and then he does a 360 and he's able to come alongside Ariana as well. So it's really neat to watch their relationship blossom as siblings as they pull together during this crisis that they find themselves in, not really pitted against their father, but not finally standing up to the facts and not giving in to the father's boundaries and I mean putting boundaries up and not allowing the father to be to wreak havoc in the life and they end up starting to stand up for their mom as well. So it's really kind of neat to watch their transformation throughout book five.

Speaker 1: 14:03

Yes, it is. And and it's even more amazing if you want to watch their transformation from, like, I guess, like book two through book five. It's kind of when all of them kind of come into play and you get to see the dynamics of the before and the after of it. And, like you mentioned, pornography is a topic that's dealt with in there. What made you want to pursue that, that theme, that topic and that was not really the theme and rolled up path to grace, but it's something that kind of leads her down a path that she finds herself in that she needs grace. So what made you want to pursue that topic?

Speaker 2: 14:54

I didn't I thought it.

Speaker 1: 14:57

Oh, that's the one where you fall God, or you're like what? Yeah, I did not want to touch it with a 10 foot pole.

Speaker 2: 15:03

I wanted nothing to do with it. And I'm like God, why, like, why are you making me do this? I don't know that much about it. I know it's devastating, I know that it affects more people than we've realized. I know that it affects pastors, I know that it affects families and it's devastating to families. But why, god? I mean, yeah, I know that you, that I am, that I am drawn to heavy topics, I know that I have a love of psychology and and I just love people marriage, family, parenting but why, like God? No, I don't want to do this. And he just said, jerry, this is, this is the topic, are you going to accept? Accept it. And I said, okay, I will do it to the best of my ability.

Speaker 2: 15:50

And in book three, actually, there's a, there's a premise or a purpose to um to this heavy topic of pornography. So it's touched on. There's another topic that's very similar, that's touched on in book three, and I really hadn't pursued that one either, or wanted to pursue that one. And God said that's what I want you to do. And then the neat thing about it is that I I write loose outlines, so I have to have like some kind of guide, and then God just takes it from there. And I remember he wrote the outline for a path to grace. And I started to write the book and all of a sudden God was like it was funny because I was writing the scene where Matt is on the roof with his roommate and his co-worker and Matt is.

Speaker 2: 16:47

Matt was introduced in book three. He was an integral part of book three. He's the twin brother to Nathaniel, the grandson to the elder um, richard, um, edwin, richard and um being raised by them because his mom you don't really find out what is going on with the mom or why. The mom I mean it's alluded to in book three Um, she has some issues. Um, and just to spoiler alert, I have written a short story to go with each book, each of the six books. Right, god had me write a seventh short story, all about Matt and Nathaniel's mom and about her lifestyle and her growing up, her childhood or her teenage hood oh, yes, um with her parents and why she turned out the way she did, why she ended up making the choices that she did, that pulled her away from her kids and um. So that one I have not shared with anybody that one. I'm going to be selling all the short stories together. I'm going to be selling them very soon, if they aren't, if they aren't out already to be looking for that.

Speaker 2: 17:53

In her book, all the seven different short stories, um, coincide with holidays. It starts with Labor Day, it ends with the fourth of July and there's a New Year's one in there. And the New Year's one is Jenny story, which is Matt and Nathaniel's mom, and so I had already written that one. So I knew a little bit about her and I knew about her, her background and her lifestyle.

Speaker 2: 18:16

And so God, as I was writing the story past, a great God said to me. He said you need to bring Jenny back in, you need to reintroduce Jenny to her boys and there needs to be redemption there as well. And so Jenny was introduced, and Greg, amanda and Luke well, luke's brother, amanda's brother in law. He plays an integral part in the pay it forward ranch, which is where Nathaniel ends up spending some time when he gets released from jail and and he takes an interest in Jenny, matt and Nathaniel's mom. So it's just really kind of neat how God layered in a whole new sub-story and a whole new sub-layer of redemption with Matt and Nathaniel's mom, Jenny, as well.

Speaker 1: 19:09

Well, you know what's interesting you were talking about, god just weaved all these stories together and put them on your heart, especially the one about pornography that you did not want to really tackle that subject. And what you wrote? Those two books are written what? Maybe about a year or a year more ago, for you know, dealing with this subject, and just recently, right, a major Christian pastor has put out a call to the church telling people and just recently, like within the past couple of months now, has said pastors, preachers, bible teachers, everyone else, we have got to start talking about sexual fan. We can't keep it hidden.

Speaker 1: 20:00

It's something that needs to be addressed, you know, and everything else. And I'm like, as you were talking, I'm like and that's what God was having you doing, he's having you address it, but you're way ahead of the game. All right, so he's having you address it because basically, pretty much what the guy was saying, if I understood it correctly, he was just like it's happening to our congregants, it's affecting our pastors, it's affecting the preachers, it's affecting the clergy, you know, it's affecting the men in the congregation, the women in the congregation, the teens. You know, it is something that definitely needs to be addressed and I love how you're not afraid to take those deep topics, you know, and address them without it being gratuitous, without it being graphic. You don't do any of that. You kind of let us know what's going on in the background without painting a picture. Does that make sense? You know it's like you're not vivid. You know it's very tasteful, but it's just very much alluded to what pretty much is going on, you know, and everything like that.

Speaker 1: 21:17

So it's done very tastefully, very skillfully actually is the word I'm looking for when you address the topic without all the graphics that come along with that, and you talk about it and how it addressed this particular family, which happens to be when an area is dead, and how it affects it and the negative consequences of it, even if you think it's a victimless crime, that oh, no one's being hurt, it's just me. But it is not a victimless crime and I'm so glad that you answered God's call and that you, that you, you took that you know and you and you just said, okay, god, I don't want to, but I am. And it also shows you that that's not the end of the story, right, that there is a path to freedom after that, that there is a path to grace after that and it just tells the story of how someone who's embedded with that type of lifestyle, how it affects the people around you. But it's not just all about that. It's the one thing.

Speaker 1: 22:28

The other thing I really love about your story is the sweet love that's in it, the sweetness, the tenderness between the relationships, the forgiveness. It it just has a sweetness to it.

Speaker 1: 22:41

You know to where I'm reading it and I'm just smiling you know, and you know, because it's just such a sweetness there, because with the ugly you show the good, you show the grace, you, you show the love that you know through friends and through family that are there, that are able to help either bring them along or suggest, love them throughout the process. And there's such a sweetness to it and I keep saying that. But that's when I, when I read your books, that's what I think of a sweet, because there's just such a sweetness to it. You know, just a tenderness and a sweetness to it and you're, you're very good at really balancing that out. You're, you're, you're not afraid to tackle the deep topics, but you also show a really, really sweet and then you also show a sweet side to it. Is that, is that just how the story develops as you're writing it?

Speaker 2: 23:39

Yeah, really Because, and then just a lot of help from from people like you who who edit the books for me, Because, yeah, I in fact I'll never forget I had a friend read a book read I don't remember. I think she was reading book three and she has a brother. I never was blessed with a brother, I was blessed with a sister. So I don't understand the brother sister dynamic. I just don't as much as I want to, I don't, and so I was writing, and I was, I guess, probably writing it from more of like a spouse way, because that's all that I know.

Speaker 2: 24:19

You know, I just I mean, I have guy friends, but that's different. So I was writing it more from a and she goes ooh, sherry, no, brothers and sisters, do not do that. I was like ooh, no, okay.

Speaker 2: 24:34

I mean, really, all it was was like was nicknamed, because Holly is the only one, or the main one in the whole series that gets nicknamed. Well, her brother started it and so the brother or so the nickname that Sean has given her, jace was calling her and she's like no, no, no, no, no. She's like she would feel so creeped out that the brotherly nickname that she has with Sean is being called, you know, by her intimate husband.

Speaker 1: 25:04

No, she's like no. Yeah, I was like okay.

Speaker 2: 25:11

So that's part of that sweetness that I just didn't get, like I didn't pick up on it because I, like I said I don't have a brother, so it just all kind of flowed together. They're like no separation, separation.

Speaker 1: 25:26

And you know and that is so true. But see, that's why we have beta readers and people who go through the stories before it. Every is the public, you know. And to go through the stories like that, because sometimes if you're writing something, I guess you've never had a brother or relationship like that. It's just completely different from having a sister, right?

Speaker 2: 25:44

Right.

Speaker 1: 25:45

I'm just completely different than having a sister. Yeah, so it's like completely different, you know, and but I love that, that, that whole sweetness with it. And alongside the very difficult topics and how you so appropriately always title your books, you know, um, because they so are, you could pretty much kind of know what the book is going to be. You don't need to read the back blurb, all you got to do is read the title. Sherry's books, you know, and you're going to know. You know what the book is really, you know, going to be about. Her titles are very apropos. Do you spend a lot of time on those or do they just kind of come to you?

Speaker 2: 26:32

Well, it is so funny that you say that, because I was working with a traditionally published person and they hated my title. They said that my title made them think of historical fiction instead of contemporary women's fiction and I was like oh how to do it differently, like I don't know, this is the one that speaks to me. So they said that the whole trail, path, road journey didn't fit and I ended up having to keep it because I didn't know any different.

Speaker 1: 27:04

So you just really made it put a smile on my face because, oh yeah, it all just kind of comes from God, like, like, yeah yeah, I guess, because in historical they tend to use those a lot, mainly because they're talking about organ trails and you know, Amish roads, you know, and things like that. But they don't have a monopoly on the terms. Right, my goodness, there's a trail not too far from my house. There's a road right outside of it. It's not called a street, right, you know so. And if you live in rural or semi-rural areas, you know, then you get those terms right. Right, you know so. Yeah, it's just like if you could walk outside and you got to go through two miles of woods to get to the pond, yeah, you're going to use words like that, you know, and that's kind of like, and that is what Green Pine does about.

Speaker 1: 28:01

That's kind of the setting Right. So the same settings that were back in history are still here. That makes them contemporary. So to that person who said that, because I love the way your titles just so much really represent the storyline that is going to go through throughout the book. And so tell us something about the storyline in book five with Ariana and her dad and the situation she gets herself in. Give us some behind the scenes tidbits, if you have any behind the story. Anything in particular inspire you, anything just made you anything funny, any trivia you know, or anything like that. What's behind the scenes of book five that readers would like to know? Just share anything that comes to mind.

Speaker 2: 29:05

Well, I had to kind of put myself in a frisky, stuck up, foiled mindset to write her. And she's interesting because she's someone who's used to getting her own way. She's someone who's not used to hearing the word no, she's someone that. And yet the very first scene is her boyfriend is losing interest in her and she is bound to determine. In fact, I think the very first line in the very first scene is I got it right here. It's easier if I just say it to you than to Ariana did not get rejected.

Speaker 2: 29:51

And then, at the very end of the first chapter, ariana did not get rejected.

Speaker 2: 29:56

So she was going to do everything in her power and she basically Ariana thought that she had the world in a bag and that her life would continue to go the way that she wanted it to. So when, when her world was upheaved, it wrecked, she was wrecked. Basically, she had to start all over again. She had to rebuild that foundation and, just like Holly was the one who came alongside Wynn and mentored Wynn, and Wynn trusted Holly to help her learn how to ride that bike and get that freedom, where Holly's mom is the one that played an integral part in Ariana's past degree, holly's mom is the one that spoke to and was able to connect with Ariana in the prissy, spoiled, selfish mode that she was in, and it was just really neat to kind of watch it go full circle where Holly's mom ministered to Holly when Holly needed it most.

Speaker 2: 31:08

In book one Holly was able to minister and mentor Wynn and Addy, and then Holly's mom, susan, was able to do the next generation. So it was just really kind of a neat full circle. And even though book six, which we'll be talking about in a couple of weeks, the newest book, is called Redemption, full Circle, the redemption and the full circle part started really in book five.

Speaker 1: 31:36

Yeah, and it's a great way to just continue and kind of keep the series going and wrap it up, because, if I'm not mistaken, book six is the last one, right.

Speaker 2: 31:48

Yep. I had to say goodbye to my friends, and that is really hard, I know, right, right.

Speaker 1: 31:57

Because they've been keeping you company for a couple of years now yeah. And yeah, so for all of you guys out there who have or like you, know what I think I would really enjoy this the sweet, tender, loving story that's not afraid to tackle some of the big topics and yet still remain very sweet in the end and full of grace and freedom than I think I really, really want to just read this series, and so you're. It's perfectly fine to do because share, I think your books are Amazon exclusive right.

Speaker 2: 32:41

Correct, which means that if you have a Kindle Unlimited I almost said prescription subscription you can read them for free with your subscription. So I did that on purpose to try to help people, because nowadays everything costs so much money. So if you have a subscription to KU Kindle Unlimited, you can read them all for free.

Speaker 1: 33:06

And that is so awesome. So that is such an awesome advantage because you can get through them and you can, like she said, if you have a KU subscription it is absolutely free and you can just be introduced to the characters of Green Pines, hear the stories from the beginning, catch up to book five and then, by the time you're done with book five, book six will be out. Am I correct?

Speaker 2: 33:32

Sherry, yes, in fact, if it's not. As a cell publisher and as someone with many, many hats and having to do the whole thing myself, I don't have an exact timetable. In that regard, I envy you because you know exactly when your books are coming out and you have people that help you along the way. But if it's not out already, it will be out very, very shortly. So you can go look for it on Amazon now book six, redemption, full Circle and if it's not there yet, join my newsletter, because I'll be talking about it on there too, to let you know when it's out, when it's going to be out, and come look on my website, because if it's out, then it's on my website as well, so check that out.

Speaker 1: 34:20

Yes, and that is at SherrySwanwellcom. So be sure to go to her website to keep up to date and, like she said, definitely subscribe to her newsletter, because then she can keep you updated on all the different things that she's doing her fiction books, her nonfiction books and as well as all the other ministries and different things that she's involved in and membership. So you definitely want to go to her website, so make sure that you're able to do that exactly after you, after the podcast ends, which we're about to wrap it up now, sherry, is there anything else you want to add?

Speaker 2: 34:55

No, nope, I just want to say if you need prayer or encouragement head over, drop us an email at cheeruppodcastgmailcom. Let us know, rsvp, if you're going to come next week at. Oh, we didn't even tell the times last week, that was my fault, so it is five to seven central time for our Twitter live next Wednesday. So a week from today, five to seven central, six to eight eastern, three to six Pacific and four to no. Three to five Pacific, sorry, and four to six mountain time. So RSVP, let us know that you're coming. If you do it, I think, kara, if they send us their snail mail even today, that should still get them their tea by next Wednesday, right?

Speaker 1: 35:51

Yes, depending on how snail like your mail is. Yes, so if you guys just send us your RSVP and you're like, yeah, we're going to be there for you guys for the cheerup podcast first live event, twitter live event audio only. So feel free to be in your pajamas, but we would love to send you a packet of tea so that we can all be sipping tea together that evening and just chatting and chatting and just you guys can ask us questions. We would like to ask you guys questions about what you would like to see about the podcast, so it'll be a blast. So, yes, if you hurry, send us an email. We should be able to get that tea out to you as soon as possible.

Speaker 2: 36:35

And, on that note, head over to karahuntcom K-A-R-A-R-H-U-N-T.

Speaker 2: 36:43

And don't forget to pick up the Habakkuk series, because we can talk about that and ask you guys when you've read, or if you've read, the different series, both the Habakkuk series and the Redemption of Green Pine series.

Speaker 2: 36:57

We can ask you guys what your favorite parts were, what you liked, what you didn't like, what you missed, what you want to see more of. Because, honestly, we write the stories that God puts in our hearts and, as you can see from what we were talking about today, it changes depending upon on what God wants written. It may not be what we originally thought, but we also want to hear from you what kind of topics, what kind of story lines, what kind of characters do you like and, as much as possible, obeying God first and foremost. We will try to see what we can come up with to keep you interested and, hopefully, write the types of stories that resonate the best with you. So, on that note, have a great rest of your week, have a great January and come celebrate with us next week, two times next week. I'll see you later.